Heart Scans: An Interview with Jimmy Moore

My friend, Jimmy Moore, of The Livin' La Vida Low Carb Show, posted this video of an interview I did with him.

I provide some background on how heart scanning came about and how it led to the creation of the Track Your Plaque program.

It reminds me how far we've come over the 8 years since the program got started. From its modest start as just an information resource to help people understand their heart scan score, to a comprehensive program that helps followers gain incredible control over coronary plaque and coronary risk that has now expanded to over 30 countries. High-tech heart procedures still dominate public consciousness, but the tremendous power of real heart disease prevention efforts are gaining more and more attention as each day passes.

Wheat Belly #5 on New York Times Bestseller list!

The New York Times just released its bestseller list due for release September 18th, 2011 . . . .

Wheat Belly is #5!! (That darned Jane Fonda woman elbowed me out for the #4 spot!

[caption id="attachment_4452" align="alignright" width="574" caption="Wheat Belly hits #5 on New York Times Bestseller List--in 1st week!"][/caption]

Interview with Jimmy Moore of Livin' La Vida Low-Carb

Here's my podcast interview with Jimmy Moore, host of the Livin' La Vida Low-Carb Show. (If you want to fast forward to the interview, go to time marker 41:20 on the slidebar.)



In the podcast, I talk about how the Track Your Plaque program and its focus on lipoprotein testing, along with the need to reverse the incredible epidemic of diabetes and pre-diabetes, led to elimination of all wheat from the diet and the book, Wheat Belly.

An open letter to the Grain Foods Foundation

Readers: Please feel free to reproduce and disseminate this letter any way you see fit.


To:

Ms. Ashley Reynolds
490 Bear Cub Drive
Ridgway, CO 81432
Phone: 617.226.9927
ashley.reynolds@mullen.com


Ms. Reynolds:

I am writing in response to the press release from the Grain Foods Foundation that describes your effort to "discredit" the assertions made in my book, Wheat Belly: Lose the wheat, lose the weight and find your path back to health. I'd like to address several of the criticisms of the book made in the release:

" . . . the author relies on anecdotal observations rather than scientific studies."
While I do indeed have a large anecdotal experience removing wheat in thousands of people, witnessing incredible and unprecedented weight loss and health benefits, I also draw from the experiences already documented in clinical studies. Several hundred of these studies are cited in the book (of the thousands available) and listed in the Reference section over 16 pages. These are studies that document the neurologic impairment unique to wheat, including cerebellar ataxia and dementia; heart disease via provocation of the small LDL pattern; visceral fat accumulation and all its attendant health consequences; the process of glycation via amylopectin A of wheat that leads to cataracts, diabetes, and arthritis; among others. There are, in fact, a wealth of studies documenting the adverse, often crippling, effects of wheat consumption in humans and I draw from these published studies.


"Wheat elimination 'means missing out on a wealth of essential nutrients.'"
This is true--if the calories of wheat are replaced with candy, soft drinks, and fast food. But if lost wheat calories are replaced by healthy foods like vegetables, nuts, healthy oils, meats, eggs, cheese, avocados, and olives, then there is no nutrient deficiency that develops with elimination of wheat. There is no deficiency of any vitamin, including thiamine, folate, B12, iron, and B6; no mineral, including selenium, magnesium, and zinc; no polyphenol, flavonoid, or antioxidant; no lack of fiber. With regards to fiber, please note that the original studies documenting the health benefits of high fiber intake were fibers from vegetables, fruits, and nuts, not wheat or grains.

People with celiac disease do indeed experience deficiencies of multiple vitamins and minerals after they eliminate all wheat and gluten from the diet. But this is not due to a diet lacking valuable nutrients, but from the incomplete healing of the gastrointestinal tract (such as the lining of the duodenum and proximal jejunum). In these people, the destructive effects of wheat are so overpowering that, unfortunately, some people never heal completely. These people do indeed require vitamin and mineral supplementation, as well as probiotics and pancreatic enzyme supplementation.


I pose several questions to you and your organization:

Why is the high-glycemic index of wheat products ignored?
Due to the unique properties of amylopectin A, two slices of whole wheat bread increase blood sugar higher than many candy bars. High blood glucose leads to the process of glycation that, in turn, causes arthritis (cartilage glycation), cataracts (lens protein glycation), diabetes (glycotoxicity of pancreatic beta cells), hepatic de novo lipogenesis that increases triglycerides and, thereby, increases expression of atherogenic (heart disease-causing) small LDL particles, leading to heart attacks. Repetitive high blood sugars that develop from a grain-rich diet are, in my view, very destructive and lead to weight gain (specifically visceral fat), insulin resistance, leptin resistance (leading to obesity), and many of the health struggles Americans now experience.

How do you account for the psychologic and neurologic effects of the wheat protein, gliadin?
Wheat gliadin has been associated with cerebellar ataxia, peripheral neuropathy, gluten encephalopathy (dementia), behavioral outbursts in children with ADHD and autism, and paranoid delusions and auditory hallucinations in people with schizophrenia, severe and incapacitating effects for people suffering from these conditions.

How do you explain the quadrupling of celiac disease over the last 50 years and its doubling over the last 20 years?
I submit to you that, while this is indeed my speculation, it is the changes in genetic code and, thereby, antigenic profile, of the high-yield semi-dwarf wheat cultivars now on the market that account for the marked increase in celiac potential nationwide. As you know, "hybridization" techniques, including chemical mutagenesis to induce selective mutations, leads to development of unique strains that are not subject to animal or human safety testing--they are just brought to market and sold.

Why does the wheat industry continue to call chemical mutagenesis, gamma irradiation, and x-ray irradiation "traditional breeding techniques" that you distinguish from genetic engineering? Chemical mutagenesis using the toxic mutagen, sodium azide, of course, is the method used to generate BASF's Clearfield herbicide-resistant wheat strain. These methods are being used on a wide scale to generate unique genetic strains that are, without question from the FDA or USDA, assumed to be safe for human consumption.

In short, my view on the situation is that the U.S. government, with its repeated advice to "eat more healthy whole grains," transmitted via vehicles like the USDA Food Pyramid and Food Plate, coupled with the extensive genetic transformations of the wheat plant introduced by agricultural geneticists, underlie an incredible deterioration in American health. I propose that you and your organization, as well as the wheat industry and its supporters, are at risk for legal liability on a scale not seen since the tobacco industry was brought to task to pay for the countless millions who died at their product's hands.

I would be happy and willing to talk to you personally. I would also welcome the opportunity to debate you or any of your experts in a public forum.

Wiliam Davis, MD
Author, Wheat Belly: Lose the wheat, lose the weight and find your path back to health (Rodale, 2011)

Do you eat wheat? I thought so.

I'm itching to say that face-to-face to anyone from the wheat industry--agribusiness, baking, retail distribution . . . anybody. Because it's obvious; it's written on the face . . . and belly, and brain, and knees, and hips. And I believe I will soon have the opportunity.

Taking such a controversial stand in my new book, Wheat Belly, i.e., that wheat products, whole or refined, have NO ROLE IN THE HUMAN DIET whatsoever, was bound to provoke criticism and counterattacks. The wheat world has already taken a blow to the chin with the growing popularity of the (misguided) gluten-free movement and they're going to have to get into the business of media damage control.

Take a look at this press release from the Grain Foods Foundation:

RIDGWAY, COLO. — The Grain Foods Foundation has unveiled plans to counter media publicity attracted by “Wheat Belly.”

“Mullen, working with key members of the Grain Foods Foundation’s scientific advisory board, is addressing ‘Wheat Belly’ through proactive media outreach and its ongoing rapid response program,” said Ashley Reynolds, a Mullen account executive. “In particular, the public relations team will be contacting health and nutrition reporters at print and on-line media outlets, as well as editors at major women’s magazines to influence any diet-related stories that may be published in the coming months.”

. . . Ms. Reynolds, a registered dietitian, noted the author relies on anecdotal observations rather than scientific studies; wheat elimination “means missing out on a wealth of essential nutrients;” six servings of grain-based foods are recommended daily in the Dietary Guidelines for Americans; healthy weight loss depends on energy balance rather than elimination of specific foods; and elimination of wheat products makes sense only for those with medical diagnoses such as celiac disease or gluten sensitivity.

She said the group will lean on its scientific advisory board members to “discredit the book and ensure our messages are backed by sound science. “


Here's some of their starting salvos on their Six Servings Blog.

This reminds me of the fight with Big Tobacco in the '70s: "No, sir, we in the tobacco industry know of no research demonstrating that smoking is bad for health," complete with shots of tobacco executives puffing away on cigarettes.

So brace yourself for a fight. These people are protecting a multi-billion dollar franchise, not to mention their livelihoods and incomes. It could get ugly.

Wheat Belly explodes on the scene!



Wheat Belly is finally available in Barnes and Noble and all major bookstores nationwide! Also available at Amazon. Electronic versions for Nook and Kindle, as well as an audio CD, will also be available.

The notion of Wheat Belly got its start right here on The Heart Scan Blog and the diet developed for the Track Your Plaque program to conquer heart disease and plaque.



Chapters in the book include:

Not Your Grandma's Muffins: The Creation of Modern Wheat
Whence and where did this familiar grain, 4 1/2-foot tall "amber waves of grain," become transformed into a 2-foot tall, high-yield genetically unique plant unfamiliar to humans? And why is this such a bad thing?

Cataracts, Wrinkles, and Dowager's Humps: Wheat and the Aging Process
If you thought that bagels and crackers are just about carbs, think again. Wheat consumption makes you age faster: cataracts, crow's feet, arthritis . . . you name it, wheat's been there, done that and brings you one step closer to the big nursing home in the sky with every bite.

My Particles are Bigger than Your Particles
Why consuming plenty of "healthy whole grains" is the path to heart disease and heart attack and why saying goodbye to them is among the most powerful strategies around for reduction or elimination of risk.

Hello, Intestine: It's Me, Wheat
No discussion of wheat is complete without talking about how celiac disease and other common intestinal ailments, like acid reflux and irritable bowel syndrome, fit into the broader concept of wheat elimination.

Here's a YouTube video introduction to the book and concept posted on the YouTube Wheat Belly Channel. Also, join the discussions on The Wheat Belly Blog and Facebook. Have that last bite of blueberry muffin, because I predict you won't be turning back!

Good fat, bad fat

No, this is not a discussion of monounsaturated versus hydroxgenated fat. This is about the relatively benign fat that accumulates on your hips, rear end, or arms--the "good"--versus the deep visceral fat that encircles your intestines, kidneys, liver, pancreas, and heart--the "bad."

And I'm not talking about what looks good or bad. We've all seen the unsightly flabby upper arms of an overweight woman or the cellulite on her bulging thighs. It might look awful but, metabolically speaking, it is benign.

It's that muffin top, love handle, or wheat belly that encircles the waist, a marker for underlying deep visceral fat, that:

--Increases release of inflammatory mediators/markers like tumor necrosis factor, leptin, interleukins, and c-reactive protein
--Is itself inflamed. When examined under a microscope, visceral fat is riddled with inflammatory white blood cells.
--Stops producing the protective hormone, adiponectin.
--Traffics in fatty acids that enter the bloodstream, resulting in greater resistance to insulin, fat deposition in the liver (fatty liver), and increases blood levels of triglycerides
--Predicts greater cardiovascular risk. A flood of recent studies (here's one) has demonstrated that larger quantities of pericardial fat (i.e., visceral fat encircling the heart, visible on a CT scan or echocardiogram) are associated with increased likelihood of coronary disease and cardiovascular risk.

You can even have excessive quantities of bad visceral fat without much in the way of fat elsewhere. You know the body shape: skinny face, skinny arms, skinny legs . . . protuberant, flaccid belly, the so-called "skinny obese" person.

Nobody knows why fat in visceral stores is so much more evil and disease-related than, say, wheat on your backside. While you may struggle to pull your spreading backside into your jeans, it's waist girth that is the problem. You need to lose it.

You could take vitamin D or . . .

You could take vitamin D and achieve a desirable blood level of 25-hydroxy vitamin D (I aim for 60-70 ng/ml), or you could:

--Take Actos to mimic the enhanced insulin sensitivity generated by vitamin D
--Take lisinopril to mimic the angiotensin-converting enzyme blocking, antihypertensive effect of vitamin D
--Take Fosamax or Boniva to mimic the bone density-increasing effect of vitamin D
--Take Celexa or other SSRI antidepressants to mimic the mood-elevating and winter "blues"-relieving effect of vitamin D
---Take Niaspan to mimic the HDL-increasing, small LDL-reducing effect of vitamin D
--Take naproxen to mimic the pain-relieving effect of vitamin D

So, given a choice, what do most doctors choose? Of course, they choose from the menu as presented by the sexy sales representative sitting in the office waiting room. These medications, of course, are among the top sellers in the drug world, taken by millions of Americans and not just one at a time, but several per person.

The Food and Nutrition Board of the Institute of Medicine, the panel of volunteers charged with drafting a Recommended Daily Allowance for vitamin D, says that you are already getting enough vitamin D, so don't bother taking any supplements and continue to wear your sunscreen. Wonder whose side they're on?

I continue to be impressed that many of the conditions that plague modern people are little more than deficiencies peculiar to modern life, such as vitamin D deficiency, or the result of the excesses of modern life, such as consumption of sucrose, fructose, corn, and "healthy whole grains."

I take 8000 units of gelcap vitamin D and haven't felt better.

More lipoproteins zero!

A few posts back, I talked about how more people are showing us zero lipoprotein(a) and zero small LDL. That was about 4 weeks ago. By then, I had seen 3 people with zero values on both.

Well, it's now up to 9 people: 9 people who have achieved zero lipoprotein(a) and zero small LDL. These are people who started with typical lipoprotein(a) values of 150-300 nmol/L and small LDL values of 1000-2000 nmol/L, both substantial.

I still don't know how many people or what percentage can expect to show such extravagant results. But the sharp increase over a relatively brief period of time is extremely encouraging!


Diet: One size does NOT fit all

Heart Scan Blog reader, Frustrated, posted this comment:

Dr. Davis,
I have spent the last 5 months eating a diet that completely eliminated all wheat products. It was very low carb, and consisted of relatively high protein (eggs, grass fed beef, grass fed raw cheese, oily fish, chicken), good level of olive oil, walnuts, fish oil (3 mg per day), raw vegetables, little bit of fruit. So I had good amount of monounsaturated fat as well as saturated fat from eggs and grass fed products.

My recent NMR showed:
LDL-p. 2,800
Small LDL particle 1700
Small HDL particle 20
HDL-C 40
LDL-C 114
Trigs. 224
Total chol 208

So I was disappointed. Where have I gone wrong? No wheat and sky-high LDL-p and 1700 small LDL particles.


This is indeed unusual. I see this perhaps 5 or 6 times over a year's time, while thousands of other people show the usual expected respone. I don't have Frustrated's lipoprotein panel prior to starting the diet, but I'll bet the starting panel was similar to this "after" panel.

The overwhelming majority of people who follow a diet like the one described--no wheat, limited carbohydrate, grass fed beef, fish, chicken, vegetables, limited fruit--obtain extravagant reductions in small LDL, increased HDL, and reduced triglycerides. So why did Frustrated end up with such disappointing results, values that potentially provide for high risk for heart disease?

There are several possibilities:

1) He/she is in the midst of substantial weight loss. When labs are drawn in the midst of weight loss, stored energy is being mobilized into the blood stream. This energy is mobilized as fatty acids and triglycerides which, upon entering the blood stream, cause increased triglycerides, reduced HDL, chaotic or unpredictable small LDL patterns, and increased blood sugar sufficient to be in the diabetic or pre-diabetic range. This all subsides and settles down to better values around 2 months after weight loss has plateaued.

2) Apo E4--If Frustrated has one or two apo E4 genes, then increased dietary fat will serve to exaggerate measures like small LDL despite the reduction in carbohydrates, LDL particle number, and triglycerides. This is a tough situation, since small LDL particles and high triglycerides signal carbohydrate sensitivity, while apo E4 makes this person, in effect, unable to deal with fats and dietary cholesterol. It gives me the creeps to talk about reducing fat intake, but this becomes necessary along with carbohydrate restriction, else statin drugs will come to the "rescue."

3) Apo E2 + Apo E4--It's possible that an apo E2 is present along with apo E4. Apo E2 makes this person extremely carbohydrate-sensitive and diabetes-prone with awful postprandial (after-meal) persistence of dietary byproducts, alongside the hyperabsorption of fats and dietary cholesterol from apo E4. This is a genuine nutritional rock and a hard place.

4) Other variants--There are probably a dozen or more other genetic variants, thankfully rare, such as apo B and apo C2 variants, that are not generally available for us to measure that could influence Frustrated's response.

5) The low-carb diet is not truly low-carb--Frustrated sounds like a pretty sharp cookie. But it's not uncommon for someone to overlook a substantial source of carbohydrate exposure that triggers these patterns. Fruit is a very common tripping point, since people generally regard unlimited fruit as a healthy thing. This does not seem to be Frustrated's problem. Others indulge in quinoa, sweet potatoes, millet or other carbohydrate sources that look and sound healthy but, in sufficient quantities, can still trigger this pattern.

6) Other--Hypothyroidism, kidney disease, nephrotic syndrome, hypercortisolism and some other relatively rare conditions are worth considering if none of the above apply.

Anyway, that's the list I use when this peculiar situation arises. If obvious weight loss is not the culprit, the next step is apo E testing. However, the wrong response is to reject the low-carbohydrate notion altogether and just limit fat, since this typically leads to uncontrolled small LDL, high triglycerides, and diabetes. It can often mean limiting carbohydrates while also limiting fats. Just as with the combination of apo E4 with Lipoprotein(a), I lump many of these patterns into the emerging world of genetic incompatibilities, genetic traits that code for incompatible metabolic phenomena.


Lead to Gold: The alchemy of transforming nutritional-supplement-to-medication

Lead to Gold: The alchemy of transforming nutritional-supplement-to-medication

Here's a recipe to make hundreds of millions of dollars. Others have done it and you can do it, too!

1) Identify a nutritional supplement that works.

Find some agent deemed to fall within the broad allowances of the 1994 Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act . However, because this agent is already in the public domain and is essential non-patent-protectable, you may need to develop some patent protectable aspect of its production, application, or encapsulation. This patent-protected aspect may or may not provide genuine advantage, but that's not your concern. Your concern is protecting your investment and providing the appearance of exclusivity.


2) Identify a medical indication for your product.

Choose a disease or condition that is likely to yield unquestioned efficacy, e.g., omega-3 fatty acids to reduce high triglycerides in people with familial hypertriglyceridemia (triglycerides >500 mg/dl). While this will restrict your ability to make market claims, it will not restrain your ability to sell or allow use of your agent for "off-label" applications. In fact, there are methods to surreptitiously promote the use of your product for off-label use, such as hiring experts to discuss the science behind your product with doctors who can prescribe your product. Ideally, your product's primary indication will provide a substantial market on its own to justify your investment. However, the eventual off-label sales can be substantial, even outstripping the sales generated through your primary indication.


3) Obtain at least $230 million to pay for the clinical trials required to obtain FDA approval.

You will also have to raise the capital to build the business to manufacture, distribute, and sell your product.


4) After FDA approval is obtained, your business is up and running, and distribution begins, start bashing the non-FDA-approved nutritional products that stand to compete in your market.

You could point out that only your product has actually passed through the rigorous FDA process. You could make claims regarding purity, potency, "approved by your doctor," etc., whether or not there is any truth behind the claim.


5) Buy that second vacation home in Aspen and the corporate jet you've been dreaming about! After all the risks you've taken, you deserve it!


That's it, plain and simple. It is a tried-and-true formula that has been applied many times.

It is a formula like this that brought Lovaza-brand omega-3 fatty acids to market, Niaspan brand of niacin, ergocalciferol form of vitamin D, Folbee (prescription combination B vitamins), with a slightly different spin for Synthroid (since the Armour Thyroid it is meant to replace is not a nutritional supplement, but a low-cost, generic thyroid replacement).

Whatever you do, don't EVER run a head-to-head comparative trial of your agent versus the nutritional supplement competition. For instance, NEVER compare Lovaza to supplemental fish oil capsules, matched milligram-for-milligram for EPA and DHA content. NEVER compare Niaspan to over-the-counter Sloniacin. NEVER compare Armour Thyroid to Synthroid. You never know what you might find. (Psssssttt! They might be equivalent!)

The formula is not a foolproof road paved with riches, however. There have been market failures, as well. Folbee, for instance, is hardly a household name. So there's risk involved, no question about it. But, should it all work out, the payoff can be big, VERY big, as it has been for Niaspan and Lovaza.

So, start thinking about how you might follow this formula for:

1) Cholecalciferol (vitamin D3)--e.g., for osteopenia, low HDL, or high c-reactive protein
2) Vitamin K2--also for osteopenia
3) Magnesium--for suppression of ventricular arrhythmias (especially Torsade de Pointes)
4) Iodine--for goiter and iodine deficiency
5) Vitamin C--for uric acid reduction

Who said you can't turn lead into gold?

Comments (25) -

  • Dr. B G

    1/9/2009 3:01:00 PM |

    Dr.D...

    What curious insights...

    Don't forget the lobbyists who get the 'Gold' onto the Medicare and Medi-Cal/Medicaid formularies (approved drug lists) though cheap, OTC or generic alternatives exist.

    Guess who pays for these indirectly?

    BTW, this does not occur at the VA MC system level which has been awesomely managed and deliver I believe good healthcare and effective drug care.

    -G

  • Dr. B G

    1/9/2009 3:01:00 PM |

    Dr.D...

    What curious insights...

    Don't forget the lobbyists who get the 'Gold' onto the Medicare and Medi-Cal/Medicaid formularies (approved drug lists) though cheap, OTC or generic alternatives exist.

    Guess who pays for these indirectly?

    BTW, this does not occur at the VA MC system level which has been awesomely managed and deliver I believe good healthcare and effective drug care.

    -G

  • Jan Jones, M.A.in Education, B.S. in Education

    1/9/2009 4:09:00 PM |

    Dr. D,

    I was taking Armour Thyroid for several years(90mg)and levels were checked and remained 'normal'. Recently, having no rx insurance I found that the AT is considerably more expensive than synthroid, so my dr recommended I switch to the correct converted dosage to get the cheaper price.  I have been concerned that the synthroid is not as good, as effective, as the AT I was taking.  By your final comment on the post are you saying those meds are pretty equivalent in effectiveness, in your opinion? It would really help me to know if I have made a good decision to follow the price and not sacrifice effectiveness.

    Thanks,
    Jan

  • Anne

    1/9/2009 5:46:00 PM |

    I live in the UK where strontium in the form of patented Strontium Ranelate (Protelos) is prescribed for the treatment of osteoporosis. I am prescribed it. It works ! I've been having it 18 months and my bone density has increased and it doesn't have the side effects of the bisphosphonates. The 'supplemental' form strontium (strontium citrate for example) however is not available in health food shops in the UK. In the US the supplemental form of strontium is available in health food stores but Strontium Ranleate has not been approved by the FDA - strange !

    Still, I'm happy as the medication only costs me the flat rate prescription charge of £7 for three months supply....so there can sometimes be a benefit depending on where you live. It currently costs me just over £25 a month to buy omega-3 fish oil from my local health food shop so next time I see my cardiologist I'm going to ask him to prescribe me Omacor as it will save me tons of money if I can get it on prescription....don't know if he'll oblige though.

  • Jessica

    1/9/2009 10:23:00 PM |

    Gee, thanks for stealing my golden parachute, Doc.

    With my 401(k) having turned into a 104(k) this year, I planned on enacting my Vit D analogue project in 2009 with hopes of making it big.

    You've foiled my plan!

    (P.S. I was also going to ask Sally Fields to be the spokeswoman for my D analogue and in the commercial, she would say something like, "I thought taking Vitamin D and Calcium would help stop my bone loss, but turns out, it didn't." Then she should plug my FDA-approved drug. Oh wait, doesn't that commercial already exist?).

    Smile

  • Grandma S.

    1/10/2009 12:12:00 AM |

    Does anyone know a good Vit K2 to take, so many choices.  Thank you!

  • Lynn M.

    1/10/2009 6:25:00 AM |

    Jan Jones,
    Normally you can buy a generic Armour for much less than what Armour costs.  However, since this summer there has been a supply problem with the dessicated thyroid products, which has made some of the generic forms unavailable and may have driven up the Armour price.

    Cost aside, from someone who has been totally dependent on thyroid supplementation for 59 years because of a congenital disorder, Synthroid is not equivalent to a dessicated thyroid such as Armour.  Synthroid only has T4, whereas Armour has T4, T3, T2, T1, and calcitonin, which are all naturally produced by the human thyroid.  For an in-depth perspective of the superiority of Armour from a patient's point of view, see www.stopthethyroidmadness.com.
    Lynn

  • Jan Jones, M.A.in Education, B.S. in Education

    1/10/2009 3:25:00 PM |

    Lynn,

    Thanks for your perspective.  Since I switched about 3 months ago, I have thought I didn't feel quite the same on the synthroid but I was attributing some of that to the change.  Next week I will have my levels checked to see if it has remained in the "normal" range on the generic synthroid.  Even if it is ok, I am leaning towards asking the dr to go back to AT.  I am still wondering if Dr.D is categorizing it in the same group as the quasi-drug/vitamins he mentions, meaning it's not really any better. My dr seems to think they are equivalent.
    I have read the info on AT, which is why I started on it over 6 years ago and at the time I had rx coverage. Dr.D is correct in his assertion that one way or another it's all about $$.

    Jan

  • Sam

    1/10/2009 4:22:00 PM |

    Grandma S., I take Thorne Research MK-4 K2.

    It's a little pricey, but at dietary supplementation dosage of less than 1mg/day, a $60 bottle should last about 18 months. (1mg/day is one drop.)

    Search with google for vendors with the best price.

  • David

    1/10/2009 6:45:00 PM |

    Grandma S.,

    I can't speak for everyone, but I like Life Extension's K2 supplement. It's not terribly expensive, and has more K2 than a lot of the other brands. 100 mcg of MK-7, and 1,000 mcg of MK-4. It's not the only one that's good, of course, but I like it.

    Here's the link at LEF: http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/Item01224/Super-K-with-Advanced-K2-Complex.html

    Also look for LEF's K2 for a cheaper price (w/ free shipping) at healthmegamall.com.

    Hope this helps!

  • Dr. William Davis

    1/11/2009 2:12:00 PM |

    Jan-

    Sorry for the imprecision.

    I believe that Armour thyroid is superior to T4-only preparations. While there are some published data to support this, real life makes it patently clear as day. People feel better, lose weight more effectively, have better cholesterol values, including Lp(a).

  • Lynn M.

    1/12/2009 7:59:00 AM |

    Jan Jones,
    The way you feel is a much better measure of thyroid sufficiency than any blood test.  Blood tests don't measure what is happening at the cellular level. Factors such as adrenal insufficiency and thyroid antibodies can leave a person with good thyroid levels in the blood but not enough hormone in the cells.

    I'm curious as to what levels you will be having checked.  The best blood tests for determining thyroid sufficiency are the Free T3 and Free T4, which measure thyroid hormone levels.  The TSH is a useless test for anyone already on supplemental thyroid. It is only an indirect measure of thyroid sufficiency and actually measures the pituitary hormone produced as part of a feedback loop. If you're supplementing, you've disturbed the normal feedback loop. I don't understand why doctors settle for the myriad of problems associated with TSH tests when they can directly measure thyroid levels with a Free T3 and Free T4 test.  But nonetheless the TSH test is considered the gold standard.  

    Even when I have been on too low a dose of generic Armour, as measured by hypo symptoms and low-in-range FT3 and FT4 readings, my TSH level was only .011 (ref range 0.35-5.50).  After years of supplementing, I guess my brain has learned that producing thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH) is useless.  Just one example of why the TSH test shouldn't be relied on.

  • mike V

    1/13/2009 5:18:00 AM |

    Lynn M
    I positively endorse your comments based on experience of >30 years of T4->T4+T3->Armour Thyroid->generic (Armour)
    The latter is actually shipped free of charge under Humana Medicare part D.(RightSourceRX)
    (An excellent price! Smile)
    MikeV

    PS:In earlier posts/comments re: thyroid,there was a suggestion that vitamin D3 supplements could significantly impact TSH readings. I would like to hear if this has been observed by others.
    M

  • Anna

    1/13/2009 7:25:00 PM |

    Having taken Levoxyl T4 in combination with a small dose of compounded, timed-release natural thyroid hormone when I was seeing a fantastic out-of-network endo (unfortunately, he was also out-of-state and the distance made it hard to use his services last year).

    Now my new (HMO network) endo prescribed  Levoxyl (T4) only, and I can say that T4 only wasn't right for me, though my labs were great (TSH about 1.0 and FreeT4 just fine).  I just didn't feel quite right on T4 alone.  

    I was able to convince the endo last spring to add Cytomel (T3) with the T4, which is much better than T4 alone, but not nearly as good as the combination of T4 and T3 in the natural thyroid extract in a ratio that mimics human thyroid physiology (98%-2%, Armour is a porcine ratio of 80%-20%).  

    So I think I'm going to continue looking for a new local doc who has the expertise to use compounded natural thyroid extract in the way that worked best for me, even if it means paying more out-of-pocket.  

    Like processed industrial food that will fill you up but won't nourish your body, some cheaper things just aren't worth the savings.

  • Dr. B G

    1/14/2009 6:01:00 AM |

    Mike V,

    I've noticed my own TSH improve from 1.3-1.9 to 1.0 on vitamin D supplementation to 25(OH)D 70 ng/ml. I stopped vitamin D this summer and noticed the TSH trended back up to 1.3.

    I've seen this trend for patients as well -- though the more wheat-damaged/addicted -- the less the improvement seen with vitamin D repletion. Guess that is to be expected.

    Yes -- there is limited science but there is a significant observation between lower TSH and summer months. I wonder WHY?? Smile

    Thank you for your info and all your insightful comments here!

    -G

  • Dr. B G

    1/14/2009 6:01:00 AM |

    Mike V,

    I've noticed my own TSH improve from 1.3-1.9 to 1.0 on vitamin D supplementation to 25(OH)D 70 ng/ml. I stopped vitamin D this summer and noticed the TSH trended back up to 1.3.

    I've seen this trend for patients as well -- though the more wheat-damaged/addicted -- the less the improvement seen with vitamin D repletion. Guess that is to be expected.

    Yes -- there is limited science but there is a significant observation between lower TSH and summer months. I wonder WHY?? Smile

    Thank you for your info and all your insightful comments here!

    -G

  • Anna

    1/14/2009 3:42:00 PM |

    Dr B G mentioned the seasonal aspect of thyroid function.  I definitely think there's something to that.  

    When I was first treated for hypothroidism by Dr. Kenneth Blanchard, who is located near Boston MA, he mentioned that many, if not most of his patients need a very slight dose-up tweak in the fall-winter months.   But I live in mild San Diego, so he wasn't sure if I'd experience that effect.  I saw him in early July that first time.  In hindsight, summer has always been my least hypothyroid-feeling time of year.

    But sure enough,  that fall I was dragging my knuckles.  The addition of an extra 50 mcg tablet of Levoxyl for a days, followed by just one more 50 mcg tablet of Levoxyl *a week* helped a lot throughout the winter.  Periodic lab draws were used in addition to my symptoms (or lack of them).  By the time I saw him again in June (with labs drawn and reviewed in the interim) I was back to the original dose.  

    This seasonal cycle has been my experience for three years since beginning thyroid hormone supplementation, and feels quite pronounced to me every Fall, but the dose adjustment needed is very minor.  I seem to have settled on a fall-winter cycle of 2 x 50 mcg Levoxyl 5 days a week, 1 x 50 mcg 2 days a week; and a late spring-summer cycle of 2 x 50 mcg 4 days a week, 1 x 50 mcg 3 days a week.

    And I don't think this cycle is temperature or weather-induced, but rather by less daylight, as the San Diego area usually has some of its warmest temps in the Fall (the winds shift from the onshore breezes to dry, warm winds from the desert).  The second time I called the endo to say I had some symptoms return or increase, he mentioned that my file indicated  that I called the same week the previous year.  So it's not that I was tuned into the calendar, either, it had to be pointed out to me, though now I am aware of it, of course.

  • mike V

    1/15/2009 7:42:00 AM |

    Dr B G, and Anna:
    Thanks for the interesting feedback.
    Vitamin D seems to be regarded as a hormone, or at least a prohormone, and I have seen it suggested that it may increase thyroid sensitivity in the tissues. If so I would expect the control feedback loop to lower the thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH) which of course calls for less to be secreted.


    My interest relates to the following.
    I have a 'night time only' wake up phenomenon, that is a sort of "adrenoline rush" with heart racing.
    This was rare at first but increased a month or two after a Fall vitamin D3 increase about two years ago.

    Now it prefers the half hour after falling asleep, or prior to normal AM awakening.
    My heart "plumbing and electrical" are in excellent order, and sleep apnea has been eliminated.
       Anna, did you have specific symptoms from the extra T3 fraction of porcine thyroid, or is it perhaps just a matter of preference, or of not feeling your 'best'?
    I have been using it for some years, and although aware, have not questioned it till now.
      
    I guess it could be a factor in my sleeping, even with the shorter half-life. My age (72) could also be a factor.
    My next step will be FT3, FT4 and 25(OH) testing.
    Thank you again for the respones.
    Mike V

    I would be interested to know if Dr D or anyone else believes that the higher porcine T3/T4 ratio has caused specific symptoms?

  • Anna

    1/15/2009 6:22:00 PM |

    Mike V,

    Vit D3 is indeed a hormone precursor.  The vitamin in its name is sort of misleading.  

    I've never taken Armour, so I can't comment on it.  I've always either taken straight T4 (Levoxyl); Levoxyl with a small dose of compounded natural [porcine] thyroid extract in a timed-release preparation; or Levoxyl (T4) with Cytomel (T3).  The later is what I am currently taking, prescribed by the endo in my HMO network.

    The Levoxyl with the added compounded thyroid extract was prescribed by Dr. Kenneth Blanchard (author of What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Hypothyroidism).  He feels that the 80/20% ratio of T4/T3 in Armour is not the best ratio for humans; he says they do well initially, but over time, the T3 content is too high for humans.  He's an endocrinologist MD and has a PhD in biochemistry, and he's hypothyroid himself.  He prefers to Rx in a T4/T3 ratio of about 98/2% and uses 50 mcg tablets of Levoxyl because they have no dyes that can cause issues for some people, and the compounded thyroid dose (for the T3), using a formula to come up with the 98/2% amounts.  

    Dr. Blanchard is the one who came up with way I take the Levoxyl, 2 tablets some days and only 1 tablet some others, because the T4 has such a long half life in the body.  Averaging the dose like on a weekly basis seems to be fine, so I have continued to do that with my current local endo, but it does drive my current endo a bit batty, but he can find little to argue with it.  If my TSH is a bit too low I adjust how many days I take only 1 tablet up or down.

    I really needed that bit of extra T3 and noticed it in mental processing and daily productivity, though I don't think it was reflected in my labs at all.  So my HMO endo added a small dose of Cytomel, but it gives me about 6% T3 now, and my TSH was .06 last time instead of hovering arounf 1.0.  So I dropped 1 tablet of 50mcg Levoxyl one day a week. I'm about to get labs done again so we'll see.  

    If I had to chose my own ratio, I think I'd do best on just a bit more T3 than Dr. Blanchard allows, and just a bit less than I get in the daily 1 tablet of Cytomel, perhaps around 4-5%.  I also liked the timed release compounded version better than Cytomel, which wears off too soon due to its short half life in the body (and it's too small a capsule to divide, but I take the smallest dose).  

    I have been taking a lot more Vit D3 lately to a) get my 25 (OH)D level up and to fend off colds this winter.  It'll be interesting to see if that is also reflected on my thryoid labs.  I'll report if anything significant shows up.

    Incidentally, I also had some gluten and casein sensitivity and gene tests done by Enterolab (www dot entrolab dot com) recently, and I was positive for IgA antibodies (both gluten and casein), anti-transglutaminase IgA, and genes for gluten sensitivity (my son has similar results except he had one celiac gene and one gluten sensitivity gene - I know of  one person in my husband's extended family with celiac sprue).  I wanted to know this because gluten reactions often correlate to autoimmune hypothyroidism (I don't think I've ever had thyroid antibodies tested though).

  • mike V

    1/16/2009 2:50:00 PM |

    Anna:
    Thank you once again for your detailed response.
    I will check out Dr Blanchard for info on my query.

    MikeV

  • Dr. B G

    1/17/2009 2:04:00 AM |

    Mike V,

    Are you taking vitamin D or A in the evening?

    These stimulate people most frequently (as they are related to daytime-foods, right? and of course solar radiation exposures).

    Take these during AM or daytime hours only.

    Armour apparently has a short half-life -- consider with your MD and try taking only in the AM.

    Hope you feel better and resolve the nighttime waking!

  • Dr. B G

    1/17/2009 2:04:00 AM |

    Mike V,

    Are you taking vitamin D or A in the evening?

    These stimulate people most frequently (as they are related to daytime-foods, right? and of course solar radiation exposures).

    Take these during AM or daytime hours only.

    Armour apparently has a short half-life -- consider with your MD and try taking only in the AM.

    Hope you feel better and resolve the nighttime waking!

  • Anna

    1/17/2009 8:09:00 PM |

    Mike V,

    Another thought occurred to me.  How's your blood glucose? Is it steady from a fairly low carb diet?  Or could you be consuming too many carbs in the evening?

    Evening carbs can initiate insulin secretion at night and drive down BG.    While sleeping, the body  senses lowered BG (maybe not even too low) and prompts an adrenaline rush to quickly raise BG, because  the liver  is "dumping" some glucose into the bloodsteam.  That series of glucose regulatory events is enough to wake some with palpitations people at the times and in the manner you describe (especially early morning, about 3-6 am), and they often see morning BG ("dawn phenomenon" as the highest BG readings of the day.  

    Another thought is that if you are taking your Armour later in the day (I think many people take Armour in divided doses during the day), perhaps the last dose is too late and the relatively high T3 kicks in too strongly.  Or it could be just too much T3 for you.  In which case, a combo of T4 and Armour (to create a different ratio than 80%T4-20%T3) might be worth trying.  In my experience, though, the average endo or primary care doc doesn't want to fiddle like that, so good luck.  The ratios aren't hard to figure out (though I had to refresh my Jr High algebra memories Smile, so maybe you could ask your doc for some samples of 50 mcg Levoxyl and titrate it yourself to see how it goes.  Hopefully you have a open-minded doc.  

    BTW, I'm taking my Vit D earlier in the day now, too P (by 1 pm) because it might have been contributing to my "night owl" tendencies, too.  makes sense to not take it later than the hours of strong sun wavelengths, anyway.  

    Good luck, keep us posted.

  • mike V

    1/18/2009 8:15:00 PM |

    Dr B G & Anna:
    Thanks for your thoughts. Incidentally I think it is not insignificant that the topics of Vitamin D and and Hypothyroidism are some of the most 'commented' on Dr D's Blog. I am convinced that getting them both right is fundamental to overall western health and well being, and all is not yet fully understood.
      
    I have already pretty much eliminated the time of day, and dosing of thyroid and concluded that T should be taken in the morning, and I take nothing late at night. I have suspected for a while that T3 fraction could be a problem, but you read the Drs with T, you come across Dr John C Lowe who disagrees strongly with Ken Blanchard's position on T3. He himself has been taking solely T3 for decades without consequences!
    Many seem to agree that TSH is not a reliable indicator, and FT3 FT4 basal temperature,and 'how the heck you feel' should be relied on.
    Yet others suggest that we hypothyroids come in two types. Type 1 (low producers, and Type 2 (supposedly involving adrenal insufficiency). Maybe some of us can be both?

    Possibly vitamin D can stimulate both the tissue sensitivity to T, and/or the ability of various tissues to convert T4 to T3.
    *****************************

    The following caused my (young male, 'you MUST treat the TSH number) doctor to laugh uproariously.

    I told him that I had moderated my "wake up" problem with celery.
    However, with celery juice, you reach a point of 'diminishing returns'.
    When he asked why, I told him that celery juice is very seriously diuretic.

    http://www.herbs2000.com/herbs/herbs_celery.htm


    Excerpt:

    The essential oil found in the celery was studied in extensive clinical researches carried out in Germany and China during the 1970s and 1980s. In these studies, it was found that the oil possessed a calming effect on the functioning of the human central nervous system and could be used to alleviate nervous disorders. On further examination, some of the chemicals in the essential oil were also found to effect anti-spasmodic, sedative, and anticonvulsant actions on the human body. The effectiveness of the oil in treating high blood pressure problems have been confirmed in studies conducted on the essential oil of the celery in the Peoples Republic of China.  

    I am now trying the seed.

    MikeV

  • buy jeans

    11/3/2010 9:58:48 PM |

    It is a formula like this that brought Lovaza-brand omega-3 fatty acids to market, Niaspan brand of niacin, ergocalciferol form of vitamin D, Folbee (prescription combination B vitamins), with a slightly different spin for Synthroid (since the Armour Thyroid it is meant to replace is not a nutritional supplement, but a low-cost, generic thyroid replacement).

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